Yowei Shaw

Yowei Shaw is a podcast host, producer and emotional investigative journalist.™️ She spent many years making the NPR podcast Invisibilia and is now making an indie podcast called Proxy. 

How would you describe Proxy in 10 words or less?
Niche emotional conundrums, investigated by proxy

Tell us Proxy’s origin story.
I was working on a story about layoffs after getting laid off from NPR in 2023. . And then I got laid off from my story about layoffs. And then I was like, you know what?  Let’s do this.And I launched Proxy with a 3-part series about the emotional and mental toll of layoffs. 

But the idea for Proxy was planted much earlier when I discovered the magic of “reporting on your feelings.” Turns out when you talk to experts and sources who have experience with your conundrum, you feel less alone. You get less stuck. I wanted to give that experience to other people.

How is Proxy now different than you thought it’d be when it first came into your mind?
The original deck included ritual. Lots of ritual. People were confused, so I took it out.

I love your nutty ideas. Tell me more about this ritual stuff!
As I was developing the show, I was reading about ritual and discovered that researchers think of ritual as one of humanity’s most efficient tools for generating the emotions you need. It struck me that proxy conversations were a kind of ritual, and I had this idea that Proxy would sometimes feature the stories of rituals people had invented to help them get through something. Anyway, glad I nixed the idea.

What is an emotional-investigative journalist?
It started as a bit. Then people latched onto the phrase - I think because there’s something funny about pairing “investigative journalist” with “emotional?” It sounds like an oxymoron. But I’m dead serious. 

Everyone has felt alone with a conundrum at some point, where it feels like no one in your life can relate. But what if there was a reporter who could find you the perfect stranger to talk to who gets it? 

Zooming out, I also think we really need to examine the psychological, sociological, historical forces that shape why we feel what we feel and the emotional dynamics that drive our behavior. We’ve finally realized feelings are important, but I don’t think we’ve gotten much further than that as a culture. So that’s where Proxy comes in, with emotions as our beat.

What did you want to be when you were eight?
Pretty sure I wanted to be President, which is embarrassing.

How are you a different audio maker now than you were when you were making Invisibilia?
I’m a lot faster.

What was the hardest thing about starting a podcast from scratch, after working at NPR?
Besides the whole money problem, I’d say the daily emotional gymnastics of deluding myself into thinking “of course, Proxy will be a hit!”- just to find the motivation to do the work. I did a whole episode about it..

Oh and trying to figure out what a fucking pixel is for Chartable (RIP).

What has helped you the most?
Honestly? Getting on Lexapro.

What advice would you give to someone who left a major platform to go indie?
Once I realized my new beat was “how to make a successful podcast in today’s terrible podcast economy” - I felt less lost. Use your reporting skills.

What can we get excited about re: the new season?
Time to strap on my tap dance shoes. We got niche emotional conundrums for everyone, whatever your flavor! Family estrangement. Band drama. The career that got away. How to speak bro. I am so excited for people to hear these episodes. Get ready.

What’s your greatest goal for Proxy? An award? A big event? A theme park?
Honestly, I just want to keep making the show with this team for people who are into it.  We’re having so much fun. So I guess, to keep having fun, no matter what happens?

What’s a podcast you love that not enough people know about?
16th Minute of Fame

What’s a podcast you love that most people know about?
On the Media

Who is someone doing cool stuff in the audio space?
I call my friend Chioke I’anson the “New Mayor of Podcasting”. He runs the Resonate podcast festival in Richmond, which is essentially a multi-day art installation with moments of beauty and ridiculousness popping off when you least expect it. It’slike a fireworks display that keeps going. Last year there was a surprise sound march to the after party, where there was a mermaid in the pool. Also, Chioke is obsessed with motorcycling?

Someone needs to do a profile on the man. In the meantime, I made him a magnet. 

What’s something I didn’t ask you that you want to talk about?
I am SHOCKED you didn’t ask me about my music video where I pole dance in a kleenex box costume as a layoff grief ritual. I’m also shocked I didn’t get more press for The Layoff Trilogy series. I sent so many emails to reporters with the subject line: “This NPR host got laid off… and made a pole-dancing music video about it.” Come on. Wouldn’t you bite?

I DID. THANKS, YOWEI!!!!